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Topic: hard start relay
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defdes
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bullet Topic: hard start relay
    Posted: 12 July 2006 at 7:50pm
Anyone have the wiring hook up for these? I was unable to complete my install due to confusion, and now that i have one of those nice color, laminated wiring diagrams, I thought I'd try it again.
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datsunaholic
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bullet Posted: 12 July 2006 at 8:00pm
A what? Is this something to bypass a direct switch to the solenoid?
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mklotz70
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bullet Posted: 12 July 2006 at 8:13pm
Basically, you take the small wire off the starter solenoid and use that to turn on a 30amp Bosch relay. Provide the main power to the relay contacts via a 10ga wire that is fused and comes directly from the battery. The other relay contact is then sent to the starter solenoid through another 10ga wire. The other side of the relay coil is grounded. When you turn your switch to start, even a weak signal from that circuit will be enough to fire the relay. When the relay fires, it will all the solenoid to pull all the juice it wants to. This is no where near as much juice as the starter motor itself will be pulling, but more than the old contacts and wires in the start circuit want to give it.

Without the relay, the click-click is typically because the solenoid is getting enough juice to move and try to engage the gear....but not enough to fully engage it. There is a set of contacts in the solenoid that don't engage until the gear is all the way in. These contacts are the ones that let the main power flow to the actual starter motor. That way, the motor is not turning when the gear is trying to engage.

Hope that was long winded enough! :)
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datsunaholic
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bullet Posted: 12 July 2006 at 8:28pm
Sounds like an awful lot of work to bypass something that's easy to fix.
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71-521
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bullet Posted: 12 July 2006 at 8:33pm
isn't this something that people sell on ebay as a kit?
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mklotz70
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bullet Posted: 12 July 2006 at 8:46pm
They have the kit...it's worth it for someone that doesn't have all the connectors/wiring on hand.

'aholic....what's the easy fix??
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datsunaholic
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bullet Posted: 12 July 2006 at 9:05pm
Have an ignition switch that doesn't have worn-out contacts? Good starter? If the starter solenoid is so fickle that it needs all the current a direct 10ga wire provides, that starter isn't long for this world.

On our very-wet vintage raceboats we don't run relays for anything because they have a higher chance of failure at a critical moment. Our starter switches are industrial momentary toggles. "K.I.S.S.". Get too complex and it's just something else to break or vibrate off (with 2000 HP in a 30' wood boat, damn near everything vibrates off).
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'68 520
'72 521 V6
'74,75,79 620s
'76,78 4X4
'76 KC
'72 510 Wgn
'78 B210
'78,81 510 Wgn
2X '78 510 Coupes
'83 720 KC

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defdes
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bullet Posted: 12 July 2006 at 10:01pm
Yes. They are advertised as "hard start" or "hot start". It eliminates the "click" that you get sometimes when starting. Its a relay that tou wire thru your starter, I got it on ebay...



I left this on my desk unposted for about 2 hrs, I see that it's already been touched on.
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defdes
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bullet Posted: 12 July 2006 at 10:06pm
My starter tho, is a brand new gear reduction, top flite item. Could be my battery, could be a ground or hot lead, butI feel like Ive checked them all ad-nauseum.
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mklotz70
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bullet Posted: 12 July 2006 at 11:04pm
Very true 'aholic......but that would really only work if you could eliminate the 30+yr old neutral safety switch at the tranny.

My wgn had a problem with clicking.....I'd hold the key and wiggle the shifter...start right up. Put in a relay and it's never had a click since. Same key switch, same battery, same starter and solenoid...same tranny switch. I just can't see having to upgrade or replace all that when I can put a $4 relay in.

Paula's rig has never had a prob and I haven't put a relay in...but then again, it doesn't go through any tranny switches.
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ratwagon
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bullet Posted: 13 July 2006 at 8:36pm
I've put one of these in both of my 510's. They both had 3-4v drop across the ignition switch while cranking. After I installed the relay, no problem at all.

It's just an easy mod that takes the current carrying load off of the stock circuit and therefore all of the components in it. This will prevent the burning up the ignition switch I see people mentioning here and there.

There is a pretty good explanation here:
http://www.type2.com/bartnik/relay.htm
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mklotz70
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bullet Posted: 14 July 2006 at 1:22am
An even better upgrade is putting the truck headlights on a relay!!

Nice link :)
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ratwagon
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bullet Posted: 14 July 2006 at 1:31am
I do that on every car I own. People flash their lights at me often because mine are so bright!
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mklotz70
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bullet Posted: 14 July 2006 at 9:39am
I still need to do it to my wgn, but Paula's rig saw a noticeable increase in brightness when I put the relay on the headlights.
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Hainz
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bullet Posted: 14 July 2006 at 10:37am
I thought I sent photos/diagram of this already to you.
Isnt it on the DVD??????

I feel unaprreciated here!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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defdes
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bullet Posted: 16 July 2006 at 8:51pm
Dont make me feel bad....I inadvertantly deleted it from my mail box some time ago. Error on my part.
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