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North West Datsun Enthusiasts Forum : Datsun : 510
Topic: fuel injection, how hard?
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anubis_4_99
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bullet Topic: fuel injection, how hard?
    Posted: 22 December 2004 at 1:15am
i've read the online articale at dime quarterly about installing fuel injection and it intreaged me, but since i needed the car for work and what not i never got around to it. now since i'm gettin the 510 back and moveing and i'll have acess to two other car's at least and i wanna try it, the list of part's and what not is very helpful, but there doesnt seem to be much in the way of direction, anyone done this? and if so could i maybe get some picture's of a similar setup, maybe some wireing and fuel line diagrams and what all you had to do to get this to work? any help would be cool, thanks
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Bleach
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bullet Posted: 22 December 2004 at 9:34am

There is no exact explanation of what to do since the parts are hard to find and there is not one best way to go about installing fuel injection. The article is meant only to be a guide for general direction.

The guy used a 200SX wiring harness and computer. Basically any 4-cyl fuel injection can be used meant for an engine near the displacement of the L20b or whatever engine you happen to be puting FI on.

Here are some pics of the JDM manifold and a home-made manifold using Z-car intake runners.

That looks like a 240SX 60mm throttle body to me. That's probably overkill for a 4-cyl engine.

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anubis_4_99
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bullet Posted: 22 December 2004 at 8:13pm
i know it's just a guide, but pic's alway's help me figure out what to do, as for the TB, with the turbo wouldnt that help my app or would it still be somewhat over kill?
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Bleach
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bullet Posted: 23 December 2004 at 12:00am
A 50mm 280zx throttle would be more than enough for a 200hp L18 turbo. The 60mm throttle is said to not even be nessisary for the L28 turbo. A larger throttle body really only adds sensativity. Too big of a throttle gives you too much "toe in" throttle repsonse. That is very annoying when trying to drive in traffic.
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anubis_4_99
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bullet Posted: 23 December 2004 at 10:58am
cool, thanks for the info, i'll hopefully be able to do this within the upcomeing month's, i'll probably end up goin with the 50mm (or something slightly smaller if possable?) since it's only a L-16
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74wagon710
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bullet Posted: 23 December 2004 at 12:12pm
A 60 mm throttle body is as big or bigger than a stock V8 5.0 Mustang throttle body.
74 Datsun 710 wagon, all original now, near perfect shape, project vehicle now.

83 Hell Camino.

07 Civic Si Coupe.

07 Yamaha R1
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anubis_4_99
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bullet Posted: 23 December 2004 at 12:21pm
i think the mustang TB's were slightly bigger, but either way i'll find somethin, if it works on another 4 cyl no reason it shouldnt work on this one
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Hainz
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bullet Posted: 23 December 2004 at 1:20pm
I have seen a few of those L series manifolds around(stock jap ones).
Never really seen it on a working car.
Seen Z22 FI ,but wasnt anything to brag about HP wise.
I think a L18, cam and some webers will still be better.
FI is better street drivablilty. I think its NOT worth the extra time and money for 10% HP. Otherwise I would see alot more of them.

TWM has the FI type manifolds. Looks like a weber /mikuni intake but threaded/or pop in for the injectors.

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dayton100
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bullet Posted: 23 December 2004 at 3:05pm
I got to drive a friends FI L18 I gotta tell ya other than the instant throttle response it wasnt too much different than my L20B with weber. either way his setup was very clean lookin and reliable thats for sure. he was running a Z 5-speed and i was ruinning an sx dogleg, and truthfully its all about the gearing anyhow (rear diff)
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Bleach
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bullet Posted: 23 December 2004 at 3:14pm

Oh, but remember he wants to go turbo. So he'll be running an L16 FI turbo, not just an L18 with injectors. The fuel injection will allow for safe and reliable boost with a proper fuel mixture.

Another thing to remember is that a 200SX wiring harness is not made for forced induction. You need a turbo 4-cyl setup or use MegaSquirt.

200SX turbo? CA18DET is close enough to your L16 in size.

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anubis_4_99
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bullet Posted: 23 December 2004 at 4:57pm
it's already turbo'd, it's the same 510 i had a few month's ago that i kept busting rear diff's in, i just wanted to get FI in there to provide better fuel coverage thru the cylinder's and a bit more reliability.. hainz, you think any of those mani's you've seen could be gotten for semi-cheap?
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anubis_4_99
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bullet Posted: 24 December 2004 at 7:31am
i'd probably have to upgrade the alt and what not now that i think about it wouldnt i...? with the stereo that's in the car the light's dim every now and then from the bass, i have yet to get a cap in it.. anyone know a alt pushin better amps i could find in a local yard that would fit?
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WhaTehFuh
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bullet Posted: 24 December 2004 at 12:31pm

The 60mm t/b came on a 4cyl btw, It's off a KA24. A friend has one on his z22. I'm about to do the same for my z20 (It came with a 2bbl t/b) However I hear the biggest bottle neck is the AFM. I believe you can "upgrade" to a 280zx one as it's slightly bigger, however you've gotta re tune it and well that ain't fun.

As for the 200sx EFI system with L series, the biggest problem is you can't Cam the engine as much as you can with carbs. Too big of a cam and it effects your AFM and apparently just makes it run worse.

3 510s, 3 620s.
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Hainz
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bullet Posted: 24 December 2004 at 4:11pm
For a Manifold,
Pat Roberts at Beacon Automotive in Ballard might know. Or his helper. I forget his name off the bat. I personally wouldnt worry about going to a FI system.
Dave Carrol had one in a box nobody wanted . That was 5 yrs ago. No body has the triggers /box for them

I went to Napa and asked for a Alternator. They listed a 50amper(upgrade) that will fit in there(Beck Arnely Brand). What they do is use a 50amper from the later cars and sleeve the bolt holes down for the 12mm head bolts. So the bolts fit nice and tite. The L16 had the small bolts. I use the 50amper but had the alternator mount drilled out to 3/8 bolt that went thru the mount and alternator.This alternator uses the 17mm head bolts.
importedcarparts.com listed a 50amper(73 620 truck) I think that you could use (sleeved down) Look at the photo of th alt and see a sleev in the hole). I dont buy Junkyard alternators. YOu shouldnt either. PS Do not buy the NAPA Echlin/Neihoff Made in USA Voltage Regulators. Autozone or Carquest has the solid state ones Wells brand they have been better. I cooked to batteries already using them. And the Wells brand is only 21-24$ So get one or 2.
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anubis_4_99
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bullet Posted: 24 December 2004 at 10:16pm
the FI will probably be an on going project, i might buy a spare motor and set that up for FI instead and see how i like it, but who know's.. as for alt's, i'd like somethin more then 50 amp's, and i alway's seem to have pretty good luck at the yard's, but if i find one that'll fit and work nicely i'll shell out for it. i dont buy anything from napa, when they charged me nearly $10 for a gas cap that i could have gotten for $4 if i'd been able to wait, they lost my busniess.. also, if i get the ecu from the turbo 200SX i'm not gonna have to have it reprogramed or anything am i to match the L motor or anything? if so it'd probably just be easier to go with a stand alone huh
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